Wannabes
********** 4/12/98 5:03 PM Begin logging Sub Pub - D/s.
Denise<busy> | <delivers brandy>
Lord Excalibur | thank you my dear
*Night Spirit [HOST] | oh great I have a ghost
Lord Excalibur | crashed and burned NS
Denise<busy> | <smiles and returns to sitting at the bar>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yep 3.x hates my little red hide :)
Lord Excalibur | you will have to update my dear
| ah my darling slave
| hello my darling
Lady Aireanna | entering room and crossing to Lord
| Excalibur........kneeling beside him on his left.
jinga | brb
Lady Aireanna | hello M'lord.
Denise<busy> | <approaches the Lady>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lord E I do have 3.0.4
Fishing | oh shit left my cig, in the other bar
Lord Excalibur | oh I see
| do you have lots of problems
Denise<busy> | <does a full, deep sweeping curtsey>
Lady Aireanna | <s>
Denise<busy> | <gracefully rises>
innocent one | hello Denise ~~~~~~~waving
shagg | hello everyone
Lady Aireanna | <s>
Denise<busy> | hi there IO!!
Lord Excalibur | hi shagg
Denise<busy> | <waving>
Lady Aireanna | whispering softly...
Lady Aireanna | hello Denise.....chuckling under my breath...
innocent one | <watching>
Lady Aireanna | knock that off dear.
Lord Excalibur | you know I shall have to watch you two
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ah good my ghostly other hald has vanished
Fishing | OOOOOOOhhhhh
Denise<busy> | <blow a kiss to the Lady>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | hald=half
innocent one | i need a map...i think ....what did i miss here?
Denise<busy> | and if I don't? <G>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | BTW Happy Easter to all <waving like a bunny>
Fishing | a kiss
innocent one | bunnies wave???
Lord Excalibur | happy Easter to you NS
Denise<busy> | <waving back>
Lady Rapunzel | Good evening, NS <smile>
innocent one | i guess they do <bs>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | hugs and hiya Lady R
Lady Rapunzel | <-- hugs Spartan and the lovely tina <smile>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | <--used to be *Ninja Bunny*
Lord Excalibur | hi Lady R
wondering | hello all
Lady Rapunzel | <smile and hugs> wondering, darling
Fishing | hair bunny's do
fit to be tied | good evening... and rehugs wondering
Lady Rapunzel | Hello, Excalibur <smile>
Erek | Greetings to all
wondering | <s> Lady R
wondering | <s> fit fit
innocent one | OMG
Spartan | A good evening to all...............................
innocent one | oohhh shit
Lady Rapunzel | <-- waves to fit <smile>
wondering | Spartan <s>, hello
fit to be tied | good evening Sparton
GrandPaDeSade | Hello all
Lady Rapunzel | Good evening, GrPa <smile>
fit to be tied | hello Lady Rap... <G>
innocent one | <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<Lady
| R>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.........
GrandPaDeSade | Good evening Lady R
Lady Rapunzel | Do I spy a crickett hug?
jinga | Sorry - I do have to leave - I'll return later.
wondering | hello, GrPa <s>
innocent one | <pout pout pout <<fit >>pout pout pout >
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ok jinga
fit to be tied | you do Lady Rap
jinga | <curtsying to the gentlemen
rob | sup evey1
innocent one | hi hi wondering
jinga | <smiling at the ladies
fit to be tied | hugggggssssss crick
Lady Rapunzel | <-- hugs crickett very, very fondly
*Katie J* | <dashing in, tossing apologies ....
Lord Excalibur | hello GPDS
Lady Aireanna | hello GrPa d
wondering | hi hi crick <s>
*Katie J* | Sorry Im' late .... kids!
Lady Rapunzel | <smile and hugs> Katie, darling
fit to be tied | KJ...<BG>..... huggggsssssss
Spartan | <s>...m'LadyR....i will tell tina hello from you,
| however she is away in ohio
Spartan | visiting family this week for the
| holidays...........oh my, <wonders what to do
Spartan | with himself, a Dom, all alnone in NYC>....<s>
*Katie J* | hugggggs, Lady R
innocent one | ~~~~~~~~~~~~waving at Spartan and
| tina!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
*Katie J* | hugggggggggs, fit
GrandPaDeSade | Hello Lord E and Lady A
Lady Rapunzel | <laughs> Now now, Spartan.. don't go getting any
| ideas above your station ;)
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Katie did you here little sis...spartan is alone
| <wink wink>
innocent one | <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<katie>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
| >>>>>>>>>
GrandPaDeSade | Back in a munite.
Lady Aireanna | hello sir.
fit to be tied | <thinking Spartan should have figured it out by now
| ...g,d,r>
Spartan | ROAR.......................
*Katie J* | ahhh, but I am promised to another, NS
Lady Rapunzel | <laughs>
Lady Rapunzel | <smiles hello to MoL>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | I know Katie, and so is he--I am always trying to
| start trouble <wink>
breeeze | hello all, sorry to be late
Master of Leisure | smiles back at LadyR......hugggs.hon
Erek | Something of a crowd tonight
innocent one | <sits and watches and hopefully learns
*Katie J* | and that's what GrandPa likes about you <g>
wondering | hello, breeze <s>
Lady Rapunzel | <smiles at crickett>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | hugs MoL
Master of Leisure | Swatttttts.NS.....the little trouble
Master of Leisure | maker,,,,wink
kara (C) | hi everybody <s>
Spartan | <s>....crickett....
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ok when the lovely GrandPa returns we shqall start
Master of Leisure | and give her a big hugggggg
wondering | hugggs kara <s>
Lady Rapunzel | NS.. swat him back! <laughs> Don't let him get away
| with that!
innocent one | <s> spartan
fit to be tied | <takes wondering by the hand.... walks over to the
| sofa.. has a seat and wraps
fit to be tied | them both up in a big blanket>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | MoL thanks I needed that
Lord Excalibur | hi all who have entered
Master of Leisure | hiya ..kara
wondering | ahh <smiles happily at fit>
kara (C) | hi MoL <s>
innocent one | <looks for m&M's too
*Night Spirit [HOST] | you kidding Lady R I am anxious for it in RL from
| him
kara (C) | huggggggs wondering
Master of Leisure | You always need that,,,NS.....<eg>
*Katie J* | <going to sit with my Master>
Lady Rapunzel | <- hands crickett a large bag of M&Ms
innocent one | <BIG SMILE>
fit to be tied | hugggsss kara <g>
Master of Leisure | hmmm....looks at the candy jar...a little
Master of Leisure | low on Easter.....
Lady Rapunzel | <- backs waaay out of that one, NS ;)
Exile | hellooooo...<s>
Master of Leisure | opens his arms for her
Lady Rapunzel | <smile> Exile, darling
Exile | <s>
kara (C) | hi fit <s>......hugggs
Spartan | brb.................................................
| .............
kara (C) | hi Exile <s>
Exile | <huggs> LR, kara
*Night Spirit [HOST] | for those who forgot the lovely breeze helped us
| with this weeks topic--how to
*Night Spirit [HOST] | tell wannabes from the real deal on line and in RL
| and how to protect us from
*Night Spirit [HOST] | them and how to learn if we are one
Exile | apologies to the host
innocent one | ~~~~~~~~~waving at kara
*Katie J* | <snuggling in>
kara (C) | is that you crickett????
innocent one | <BIG SECRET SMILE
innocent one | yep
kara (C) | didn't recognize you <s>......hugggggs
*Katie J* | hiya, Ex .. we are still in the greet and grope
| portion of the conference.
*Katie J* | not to worry.
Exile | woohoo...hi katie
Lady Rapunzel | Exile.. it's not compulsory <laughs>
Master of Leisure | groping.....finds his favorites
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yep when GrPa returns we shall begin so get your
| thinking caps on
Exile | <grin> Lady Rap
fit to be tied | <laffin at MoL>
Lady Rapunzel | <-- always hated the cap
Master of Leisure | curls her leg between his
*Katie J* | favorites? <pouting>
Exile | well Tyriania isn't here so I guess not...LOL
Master of Leisure | winks at fit
innocent one | <just gropes for M&M's>
Lady Rapunzel | <laughs> Now now, Exile ;)
Exile | now???
Exile | <weg>
Lady Rapunzel | <roaring>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Exile thanks for the apology whatever it was for
GrandPaDeSade | Back again
Lady Rapunzel | NO!
Master of Leisure | kisses her softly......both of them,,honey,,,
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ah good my love
Exile | awww..<pout>
*Katie J* | ooOOOooo
Exile | <---is on a chocolate high
Spartan | returns ................................<s>
*Katie J* | welcome back GrandPa .. good to see you <s>
spicee | <here...quietly listening....
Exile | hi spicee
Master of Leisure | <---needs chocolate
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Ladies and Gentlemen get the last grope hug and
| grope in
Exile | <huggs>
kara (C) | hi spicee
Lady Rapunzel | <-- is on a being-in-love high <smile>
innocent one | <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<,spicee>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
| >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
spicee | hi exile Hugs....
Master of Leisure | Hey,,GPDS..good to see ya...
spicee | innocent one?!??!? ROFLMAO huuuuugggsss you (ICU)
kara (C) | LOL
*Night Spirit [HOST] | I have an announcement to make first
Erek | wb GrPa <hmh>
spicee | hugs kara
Lady Rapunzel | <listening>
Master of Leisure | gropes and squeeezes..hmmmm...i love
Master of Leisure | it....
innocent one | LMAO took you that LONG ROFL
Exile | hi wondering, didnt see you at the bottom <s>
GrandPaDeSade | You made it MOL. Glad to see you.
wondering | hi Exile
spicee | <kinda slow tonite crock...
*Night Spirit [HOST] | the last sunday of September is the Folsom Street
| Faire here in SF
Master of Leisure | yep..left the dog show early
Spartan | <s>...GPDS............
*Night Spirit [HOST] | 300,000 folks will be there
innocent one | of poop
Master of Leisure | onlyh 300,000
GrandPaDeSade | Hi Katie, Erek, Spartan
*Night Spirit [HOST] | the Folsom Street Faire is a bdsm street faire
breeeze | sounds fun
Master of Leisure | it is breeze
Lord Excalibur | really
Jennifer | hello all
*Night Spirit [HOST] | During the time we are planning a QVB/ch 10 party
| here in SF
kara (C) | hi Jennifer
innocent one | (doestnt breese have too manyee"s?)
breeeze | ??/
*Night Spirit [HOST] | so details will be coming but make a note on your
| calenders
innocent one | hi jj~~~waving
Master of Leisure | hmmmm....checking his calendar
Lady Rapunzel | Makes it a softer breeeze?
breeeze | meant to be that way
GrandPaDeSade | Boring dog show MOL, or just can't live without us?
| (Or was it Katie J. you
GrandPaDeSade | wanted to see?)
kara (C) | her style i guess <s>
Spartan | <---------------- has alredy bugun the planns for
| next years meet in NYC for
Spartan | Valentines again....everybody mark the time and
| save your
Spartan | pennies.........................
Lady Rapunzel | <-- noting on calender, checking flight details..
| thanks, NS <smile>
Jennifer | hello cricket..... did you get my ICQ messages???
innocent one | ooopsss noo too many beers here sorry
Lady Rapunzel | <-- writing in Valentine's Day with a big red
| marker pen, Spartan
innocent one | yes jj i di <S>
Lord Excalibur | we have a Valentines bash here as well, its held
| in Portsmouth this year
*Katie J* | <blush>
Master of Leisure | kewll...Spartan,,,,i will be there
Exile | <trying to even find a calendar that hasn't been
| packed already for the move>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | OK also to add to that announcement we will be
| housing some here--on a first
*Night Spirit [HOST] | come first serve details to follow
Master of Leisure | dont want to miss katie this time
Lady Rapunzel | Ahh.... MoL, at last we get to argue in real life
| <laughs>
Jennifer | good....
*Night Spirit [HOST] | OK--on to our CO--wannabes--how to tell from the
| real thing, how to protect
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ourselves and how to learn to go from wannabe to
| the real thing
breeeze | thanks for the invite
breeeze | NS
*Night Spirit [HOST] | breeze thank you for the topic :)
innocent one | who is recording this?
Master of Leisure | I cant wait...Lady R......lafffin
breeeze | you are so welcome
Lady Rapunzel | <-- is recording
*Katie J* | I am recording. <s>
Master of Leisure | Valentines is great,,LadyR
*Night Spirit [HOST] | <--is recording
Lady Rapunzel | <smile> MoL
innocent one | i will need a copy as i will have to leave soon
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ok people enough kissing let's hear your thoughts
Jennifer | ~~~waves bye all
Lord Excalibur | I always record innocent one
*Night Spirit [HOST] | innocent one just email me :) or Katie :)
Master of Leisure | hmmm..lilkes to grope while she
Master of Leisure | records...tickles too..hehe
*Katie J* | A wannabe has no respect for you as a person.
innocent one | can you always send LE?
Lady Aireanna(busy) | looking up to concentrate ....
lost toy robot | <missed the topic.....
Lord Excalibur | of course my dear
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Katie how can you tell a wannabe--what signs should
| you look for?
Master of Leisure | and they can be rude,,,,,does not like rude
breeeze | the reason i brought this up, is that as a sub, a
breeeze | wannabe Dom is very dangerous, may not know where
breeeze | the limits are
innocent one | lol at spicee ....go figure!!!!!
Lady Rapunzel | May I clarify the subject? What are we classing a
| "wannabe" as?
*Night Spirit [HOST] | hiya lost toy robot--topic how to tell wannabes
| from the real thing
lost toy robot | :-P innocent one
*Katie J* | One who starts ordering, with out any discussion of
| limits
lost toy robot | thank you, NS....
*Katie J* | at least, that's been my experience.
Lady Rapunzel | Some here are happy just to play bdsm online... are
| they "wannabe's"?
breeeze | don't we all start as wannabe's
*Katie J* | not necessarily, breeze
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lady R I do not think those who play on line are
| wannabes
Master of Leisure | that is different from what kate is talking
Master of Leisure | about,,LadyR
Lady Aireanna(busy) | nodding....
Lady Rapunzel | Just wanted to check
Erek | LR - I'd say that 2D only is not enough to qualify
| one as part of the D/s scene, so - yeah - wannabees
*Night Spirit [HOST] | as much as those who order you around and know
| nothing about you
Lady Rapunzel | Ahh.. so we disagree on that already?
*Night Spirit [HOST] | or subs who come on line I want a Dom to whip me now
GrandPaDeSade | A wannabe is someone who wantd to try D/s, but
| doesn't have a clue, and tries
GrandPaDeSade | to do it before finding out how.
Master of Leisure | laffffin....of course...
Erek | NS- that's a DoMeNow <g>
Lord Excalibur | thats true GPDS
Spartan | NS, it has been my experience and in review of my
| growth along the last few
Spartan | years, that as one progresses on their own journey
| of learning, one true of
Spartan | heart vs. a wannabe will begin to surface and be
| recognized within your
Spartan | conversations etc. . tho this is not a quick
| answer, too many are "well read"
Spartan | and can easily pass to the unknowing, look, listen
| carefully and learn urself,
Erek | Not necessarily a wannabe
Spartan | then u will be able to distinguish, it actually
| hits u in the face.....
Lady Rapunzel | Is that just another way to learn, GrPa? In a
| medium where mistakes are not physically painful?
*Night Spirit [HOST] | :)
Spartan | i understand not a quick guide, but it will happen
| for those in pursuit of
Spartan | their paths.....................
Lady Rapunzel | We are discussing *just* this medium, right?
GrandPaDeSade | In a medium where there is no danger, it works, but
| people can be hurt here is
GrandPaDeSade | you don't know what you are doing.
Lord Excalibur | when I have been asked I always point in the
| direction of some of the web sites
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ok Spartan has made a good point--but I think in
| many ways one who reads is
*Night Spirit [HOST] | somewhat better then those you just pop up with
| Mistress or Master titles or
*Night Spirit [HOST] | subs and are clueless
*Katie J* | I dont' think that limiting yourself to the online
| genre makes you a wannabe
*Katie J* | ... its *how* it is expressed that sets that line
| for me.
Exile afk-5 | you can still be "hurt" even online
GrandPaDeSade | Online is ok, but many go to R/l and try the same
| things.
Lord Excalibur | As D/s is mental in the true sence here can be more
| dangerous
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lady R we are discussing how to tell the real thing
| from a wannabe
GrandPaDeSade | VERY true.
Exile afk-5 | I agree LE
Master of Leisure | that is true,,,exile.....
Erek | Maybe from 2D there is little danger of physical
| damage (some, but not alot) there is always
| emotional damage
breeeze | because it is based on trust
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Exile is right you can be
Lady Rapunzel | Surely the whole bdsm scene here, in this medium,
| is very different to any other type of bdsm scene?
Exile afk-5 | physical pain is often easier to cure than mental
| torture
Lord Excalibur | very true Exile
Exile afk-5 | yes LR, its a completely different activity
Exile afk-5 | its a scene in itself
GrandPaDeSade | And trust is a critical part of D/s
*Night Spirit [HOST] | oh yes Lady R, but we still have those who come on
| line, pretend they know it
*Night Spirit [HOST] | all, and ask to meet the sub or dom and are
| clueless--how can we tell?
Lady Rapunzel | So we are talking about a different set of values
| and directions, are we?
*Katie J* | Exile, you type well while you are afk <g.
Lady Aireanna(busy) | and respect...
Lord Excalibur | GPDS you keep taking my thoughts <s>
Exile afk-5 | i use my cane
*Night Spirit [HOST] | :) Katie J <wink>
breeeze | as Spartan said, often it doesn't take long to
| figure out
GrandPaDeSade | Great minds run off the same track Lord E
*Night Spirit [HOST] | breeze that is true but at times it does..here in
| SF, a dungeon as AOL
*Night Spirit [HOST] | parties--want to talk about dangerous people
Lady Aireanna(busy) | wrapping my arm around my masters leg listening
| intently
GrandPaDeSade | (Yes, I ment off)
*The Inspector* | NS........you can always ask that the limits be
| 'defined' and if they have no
*The Inspector* | idea whats going on you can tell
*Katie J* | but for those who are new on the scene, oftimes the
| wannabe is their sole
*Katie J* | experience
Lord Excalibur | Most wannabe jump straight in before getting to
| know who they are talking to
Lord Excalibur | <tanks GPDS>
Exile back | <sitting again>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | The Inspector has made an excellant point
Spartan | i am afraid that from what i have seen taking
| place, it is the sub, who places
Spartan | <early in her own knowledge> heself in danger,
| actual physical danger too
Spartan | early, and begins trusting in what someone says,
| and they dont realize, you
Spartan | always have a choice to leave, tho it may be
| dificult based on the play<ie
Spartan | bondage>, however, please, dont feel like ..omg I
| have found what i have been
Spartan | searching for all my life....and rush into it..take
| ur time, if is right all
Spartan | will work out at some point......
*Night Spirit [HOST] | I agree Lord E
Spartan | cotract contrac contract contract contract...
GrandPaDeSade | I always sent a pre-negotiation form when i realize
| the person hasn't a clue
breeeze | perfectly sais Spartan
Lady Rapunzel | Surely the same precautions apply to any kind of
| transfer from online->RL?
Spartan | write it down, expectations limits
| etc..................
Exile back | yes Spartan....too many move straight to a slave
| role and do not understand
Exile back | that they still have rights
innocent one | <watching intently>
GrandPaDeSade | That gives them something solid to think about.
Lord Excalibur | when interacting with anyone for the first time
| theremust be, as far as I am
Lord Excalibur | concerned several basic questions
innocent one | this isnt going to work brb
Lord Excalibur | one I always ask, or advise to ask is what they
| consider D/s to be
Erek | At least if no contract lots and lots of talk and
| open discussion - what experience, hard limits, are
| there some to be pushed,
crickett<!PK!> | whew better!!!!!
Erek | who do they know that you know, etc.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lord E good idea, what other questions do you ask?
GrandPaDeSade | Lary R, yes, but the added trust issue here, plus
| the tendency of the sub to
GrandPaDeSade | obey, cause more problems.
Lord Excalibur | desires, what they expect to gain, and of course
| things like age
Lord Excalibur | as you know I am totally devoted to my darling LAdy
| Aireanna
Lady Rapunzel | IMHO, there is much talk of this nature within the
| room... and anyone with brains enough can talk the
| talk if they do the reading.
Lady Rapunzel | To bluff is easy, here.
crickett<!PK!> | ....hmmmmm trust to me is not some thing that is
| gained over night
Exile back | agreed Lady Rap....its easy to "play the game " if
| you want to con your way in
crickett<!PK!> | it takes time...and an effort on both parts
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lady R I agree so how do we protect ourselves from
| these folks?
GrandPaDeSade | Actually, since age doesn't bother me much in
| either direction, what age they
GrandPaDeSade | expect is more important to me. (I'm 54.)
Lord Excalibur | thats true Exile and Lady R
Master of Leisure | that comes with time and a lot of discussion
Master of Leisure | between the two people involved....LE.....on
Master of Leisure | should never rush into a slave or sub role with
Master of Leisure | out knowing as much about the wannabe or the
Master of Leisure | Dom
Exile back | just sit and watch for a few weeks and copy
Erek | subs should likely always get referrences from subs
| the would be Dom has played with before - if any,
| and if not ---
Lord Excalibur | but you can still catch them out
Lady Rapunzel | And also, we run a greater risk of bluff because
| there are so many *obvious* basic rules.... to be
| spoken aloud and believed.. this
Lady Rapunzel | happens a lot, I think.
Master of Leisure | and visa versa....
Erek | well then you know at least you have a beginner
Exile back | I think the fact that we get to know each other
| helps
Lord Excalibur | true Mof L
*Night Spirit [HOST] | I agree Lady R--and very good point
crickett<!PK!> | comman sense that is what is called
Exile back | we help each other to recognize problem children
Lady Rapunzel | All you have to do is say things like, "Safeword,
| growth, trust and respect, mutual exchange..." and
| anyone with a brain can string
Lady Rapunzel | them together convincingly without having a clue
| what they mean.
Master of Leisure | after a while,,,,Erek,,,you can tell the beginnner
Master of Leisure | versus the real sub or the real Dom
Lady Rapunzel | Can you, MoL?
Lady Rapunzel | How?
Lord Excalibur | I don't totally agree Lady R
Master of Leisure | agrees with Lady R
Erek | MoL - after a little while may be too late for a
| new sub
Lady Rapunzel | <-- could fool you, Excalibur, and *I* am not very
| bright.
Lady Rapunzel | It's all words here.
Master of Leisure | well,,,just today the Easter bunny wanted me to
Master of Leisure | play with her and her sister emma.....
Master of Leisure | chucklin
Lady Rapunzel | Some are easily fooled (and I do not mean you in
| particular, Exc)
Master of Leisure | wannnabe
Spartan | you know, common sense plays a major role, cyber or
| r/t...i am reminded of
Spartan | someone we knew about 2 years ago on 10, who was
| strictly cyber, yet, at the
Spartan | demands of her Dom OVER THE PHONE, she did not know
| when to rely on her own
Spartan | judgement and during a pain session <again over the
| phone>...struck herself
Spartan | over and over and so severe that she ended up
| calling 911 and was in the
Lady Aireanna(busy) | looking at Lady R
Spartan | hospital for a week recovering from the self
| inflicted beating........<i to
Spartan | this day am still amazed>................
Lord Excalibur | I should hope not my dear
GrandPaDeSade | But some things are obvious. When someone tells me
| they can hit anywhere with a
GrandPaDeSade | whip, or that they will do anything they are asked
| with no limits and no
GrandPaDeSade | safewords, either they are uninformed or
| unbalanced. I will exercize MUCH
GrandPaDeSade | caution in either case. (At least until I find out
| which.)
*Katie J* | <planning a Welsh rabbit lunch tomorrow>
crickett<!PK!> | <decides to kepp quiet...>
crickett<!PK!> | keep too
Master of Leisure | not really,,,Eric,,,,,,a new sub needs to check out
Master of Leisure | as much about the wannabe as possible.....
*Night Spirit [HOST] | the problem is--if you read, and watch you can talk
| the talk, but when you are
*Night Spirit [HOST] | tied up is not the time to find out they can't walk
| the walk
*The Inspector* | knew someone like that on 10 Spartan
crickett<!PK!> | <sigh>
Lady Rapunzel | There is, let's be honest, no way we can help those
| who fall into those traps, Spartan, unless they
| come to someone for advice...
Lady Rapunzel | and how are they to know whom to ask?
Exile back | why cant the old hands help the new ones??
Exile back | if the new ones really want to learn they will take
| advice
Lady Rapunzel | How do you propose they do that, Exile?
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Exile because how do we know for sure
kara (C) | me too crickett.........just listening
Erek | MoL - I agree about checking things out, however a
| newbie has less chance of recignizing a problem,
| especially re wannabe Doms
Exile back | wannabees will just shrug and go there own way most
| of the time
Lord Excalibur | Well why do we not post a rota of true Doms and
| subs who new and wannabees can
Lord Excalibur | come to for advice
Master of Leisure | good point,,GPDS
Spartan | if u r online enuf, as in our room , u know...u can
| see who to ask, they stand
Spartan | out and always makethemselves available....
crickett<!PK!> | because we have to learn sometime on our own Exile
Lady Rapunzel | And who will choose the Wise, Excalibur?
*Night Spirit [HOST] | I like the test ideas, send pre-negoation forms,
| ask questions on limits, and
*Night Spirit [HOST] | what is D/s
Exile back | thats true crickett but its also wrong not to offer
| at least some guidance
Exile back | or people will get hurt
crickett<!PK!> | after alll IT IS OUR CHOICE
Master of Leisure | I agree Erek,,,,but she has to be responsible
Master of Leisure | enuough to discover if he is a true Dom or
Master of Leisure | not.....
Lady Rapunzel | Yes, but who is to offer that kind of advice, NS?
| How can that be made obviously available?
crickett<!PK!> | hell life hurts...you told me that
Exile back | <huggs> crickett
Lord Excalibur | by discussions like this to see who is truly into
| D/s
crickett<!PK!> | nooo i dont want that
Don | where did u learn the lingo?
Exile back | ...so we dont need even more wringly inflicted pain
| do we??
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yes crickett that is true but sometimes, we make
| bad ones--aftrall we are
*Night Spirit [HOST] | human--and worse as D/sers we are very trusting
| humans
Lady Rapunzel | And who invites those that need to hear this stuff,
| Exc?
crickett<!PK!> | it is called comman sense Exile
GrandPaDeSade | When I realize someone is new and has no idea, I
| will try to help. If they
GrandPaDeSade | won't listen, at least i tried. (But I will stay
| far away after that.)
Erek | MoL -How the hell does any sub learn who is real?
| Also the terms *True Dom* and *True sub* are
| trademarked <g>
Lord Excalibur | we don't invite they come of their own free will
Exile back | i see a lot in here with very little common sense
| crickett
crickett<!PK!> | people in genral an make bad shoices
crickett<!PK!> | D/s or not
Erek | <kisa, my sub, is rolling on the floor hysterical
| with laughter>
Don | boxing?
Don | pro?
Exile back | thats waht I think you should do PPDS
crickett<!PK!> | i know Exile i may be one of them....
Master of Leisure | discussion...Efek.....the more she talks with that
Master of Leisure | person..the more he or she should know......
Exile back | GPDS
*Night Spirit [HOST] | or worse Erek how does a Dom know if he or she is
| dealing with a sub with
*Night Spirit [HOST] | experience or a wannabe?
crickett<!PK!> | but that doesnt mean i stop learning
Master of Leisure | and he or she can ask others and get as much
Master of Leisure | info as possible.....
GrandPaDeSade | Yes Exile?
Exile back | what do we do if we see a wannabee Dom closing on
| an inexperienced sub in the
Exile back | room??
fit to be tied | <grabbing crickett.... wrestling her into a
| chair... hugging her...>
CheriLynn | yikes I think that I'm here.. 1.3.1 software.
Spartan | one must consider this like shopping, u dont go and
| by the first one or just
Spartan | buy cause it was on sale.....no, u need to research
| and take ur time, remember,
Spartan | let the buyer beware...only this cannot or the bad
| experience , isnt refundable
Spartan | within 7 days accompanied by a sales
| slip..............
Master of Leisure | tests...NS...tests
Erek | MoL - since they (the newbie) can only have a vague
| idea of what is involved, how do they know???
crickett<!PK!> | damn it fit does that mean shut up again?
Lady Rapunzel | IMHO, the situation is worse because within this
| community there are so many different types of subs
| and Doms, each looking for a
Lady Rapunzel | different style of bdsm.... what is frightening and
| completely wrong for one may be what is right for
| another....
*Night Spirit [HOST] | good questions Exile--ok should we interfer with a
| wannabe coming on to one of
*Night Spirit [HOST] | our friends?
breeeze | so if i came to one of you, and asked do you know
| this
breeeze | person? would you be honest, or would you question
breeeze | my motivation?
Don | can i have some pics?
fit to be tied | <G>
Lady Aireanna(busy) | good point Lr
Erek | I don't see any specifics reasons to label someone
| real or not based on no knowledge on the
| questioners part
Master of Leisure | they need to ask..Erek...the more they ask,,,the
Master of Leisure | more they learn....from other subs or from
Master of Leisure | other Doms...
Exile back | I persoannly think we should warn our friends...in
| as friendly a manner as
Exile back | possible
Don | No?
GrandPaDeSade | If I think there is a chance they will be hurt, I
| will try to warn them in
GrandPaDeSade | private chat. Doing it in open will get you flamed
| at times. Sometimes they
GrandPaDeSade | listen, sometimes not.
Lord Excalibur | agree Mol
Exile back | agree GPDS
Lord Excalibur | thats true GPDS
Exile back | not on open under any circumstances
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ok think about it--can all of you be honest with
| your on-line friends about
*Night Spirit [HOST] | other users?
Lady Aireanna(busy) | nodding at GPDS
Exile back | yes NS...why can you not be???
Lady Aireanna(busy) | yes
wry告lk | <<would like to think so NS
Lady Rapunzel | Some come here openly *looking* for a more harsh
| approach; some *need* that... who are we to say
| what is right for them?
Lord Excalibur | yes NS
Lady Aireanna(busy) | always
Master of Leisure | i would be honest with you breeze
fit to be tied | yes... absolutely NS... not a question
Don | y not?
*Katie J* | yes, Lady R ... just like vanilla, BSDM comes in
| many flavors ... and one can
*Katie J* | only compare flavors by communicating.
GrandPaDeSade | I will also tell them WHY I think the person is a
| wannabe
Lady Rapunzel | How can you tell danger from something that just
| isn't your scene?
crickett<!PK!> | ok look....what if it is 2 that dont know the
| rules....not sure....but they
crickett<!PK!> | want to learn......they are together.....does that
| make the wannabe"s.....i
crickett<!PK!> | mean what if they WANT to learn the lifestyle.....
| what then? ...whoguides
crickett<!PK!> | then>?
*Katie J* | My insides scream ... NO!
Erek | Lady R - excellent point
Lord Excalibur | you can only advise given your own preferances
Exile back | I dont think you can LR...that is why I think we
| should offer advice if we
Exile back | think it is needed
*Katie J* | and I listen.
Don | after all, most likely, we are all true subsets of
| some larger one's.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | good I am glad to hear it--now if a dom<me> wants
| you to cut yourself off from
*Night Spirit [HOST] | online friendships and talking abou them--this is a
| warning
Lady Rapunzel | Vanilla comes in different flavours? <laughs> Just
| teasing you, Katie
crickett<!PK!> | <sigh>
Erek | after 30 years in the scene, I found <another
| forum> and got more bs there than ever in 3D
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lady R--and so do we :)
crickett<!PK!> | i will never learn..
Don | the age matters, too?
Master of Leisure | I try to discuss with the new sub or the new
Master of Leisure | Dom what BDSM is and how one lives the
Master of Leisure | lifestyle..the more I talk to he or she,,the more I
Master of Leisure | find out about them....if they want to learn, that
| is
Master of Leisure | good and they are honest and sincere...if they
Master of Leisure | dont,,,,they are a wannabe
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Don does it?
Don | you know, the advantage.
Exile back | agreed MoL
GrandPaDeSade | Sometimes it's obvious Lady R. I don't like blood
| sports, but when I saw
GrandPaDeSade | someone who wanted to make one inch deep cuts, I
| knew it was trouble.
Exile back | most wannabees are only after quick thrills
Lord Excalibur | totally agree MOL that is my approach as well
Lady Aireanna(busy) | cringing.....
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ok so we all agree talking and listening (seems I
| typed this before) is
*Night Spirit [HOST] | important in our protection
Master of Leisure | nods at LE
Lady Rapunzel | Wait, wait... what we are saying here is that bdsm
| is an oral (no pun intended) tradition, and that
| *we* are responsible for
Lady Rapunzel | handing down the rules and regulations. Is that
| right?
crickett<!PK!> | <listens>
Don | as a team, definitely.
*Katie J* | for ourselves, perhaps?
Master of Leisure | i try to help them as much as possible ..to get
Master of Leisure | them to learn and understand about us.........
Exile back | yes, individually though we only know ourselves
Lady Aireanna(busy) | it is mental as well......
*Night Spirit [HOST] | please know I am not discouraging virgins--I am
| discourging wannabes from
*Night Spirit [HOST] | hurting us--cuz they never listen or learn
wry告lk | I've looked to several of you for "oral tradition"
| and
wry告lk | it seems to have been ok.
Exile back | together we form a group with a wide =variet of
| likes and dislikes
Lady Rapunzel | Okay.
Lord Excalibur | no rules and regs just what we consider to be
| right, then they move on to
Exile back | with good advice to offer
Lord Excalibur | another and see what they consider to be
| right............
crickett<!PK!> | huh silkie?
Exile back | as a whole
Master of Leisure | smiles at wry
Lady Rapunzel | Sounds good to me
Erek | <==== Hearing here the same discussions as in the
| Leather community (tribes) fromj 20 years ago
GrandPaDeSade | Expect no help from the authorities. (They would
| like to jail us all to
GrandPaDeSade | "protect" us from ourselves.)
Master of Leisure | I will hellp anyone who has questions and
Master of Leisure | seeks answers to understand the lifestyle
fit to be tied | <laffin>
crickett<!PK!> | <Deep deep deep sigh>
Exile back | <s> GPDS
Lady Rapunzel | So then.. what if there are wannabes within this
| group, handing down what we consider to be the
| *wrong* traditions?
crickett<!PK!> | promise Mol?
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Erek yes I bet, but remember a whole new generation
| learns from the old timers
…him | hi haughty
Lady Aireanna(busy) | very profoundGPDS
Master of Leisure | lafffin.....have some good friends who are
Master of Leisure | authorites....
wry告lk | wannabees are pretty transparent.
Lady Rapunzel | Who are we to preach?
namdam | howdy, folks
Exile back | interesting point Lady Rap
Lady Rapunzel | Who says *we* are not wannabe's?
crickett<!PK!> | so kidding silkie
*Katie J* | Anything you hear, from anyone ... has to have
| meaning to what is in your soul
*Katie J* | ...... if it doesn't ring true, then you are
| speaking to the wrong person.
Lord Excalibur | we are not preaching Lady R
*Katie J* | no matter how Real, or Wannabe they may be.
GrandPaDeSade | I would also be available for any questions anytime
| from anyone.
Erek | Part of the problem may just be this medium --- too
| quick, too fast, too intense
Lord Excalibur | I agree with Katie
Lady Rapunzel | Katie.. before you met MoL... did you know your own
| soul?
wry告lk | it's evident that you aren't Lady R.. you've earned
wry告lk | the respect that is shown by folks coming to you for
wry告lk | guidance.
namdam | bye
Exile back | Erek...that depennds how quickly you take it
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lady R let me ask you this--I come on line and ask
| to whip someone, I come back
*Katie J* | He lights up parts that have bbeen dead for years
| .....
*Night Spirit [HOST] | day after day and get wrysilk to come visit me--you
| think I am an idiot and
*Night Spirit [HOST] | know nothing--do you tell wry?
Lady Rapunzel | We are if the listener sees us as preachers, Exc
Don | any difference?
*Katie J* | but those parts were always there, and yes, I knew
| them.
Leda | <sneaking into the back of the room>
Master of Leisure | WE were all wannabes at one
Master of Leisure | time,,LadyR......we asked questions,,we
Master of Leisure | learned,,,,,,we experienced...
*Night Spirit [HOST] | hugs Leda and welcome
Exile back | I know some people get collared inside of a week
Lord Excalibur | not in the way I puit it over LAdy R
Spartan | u know, the one suggestion i am not sure if it was
| mentioned earlier, but i
Spartan | still feel that , if you have found an environment
| on line you trust and feel
Spartan | comfortable in, then there are people there u trust
| <as far as oppinions at
Spartan | least>....ASK, see if you can get references...if
| they are new, well, just dont
Spartan | pounce, wait, see, generally they will show
| themselves to someone.........but
Spartan | get references, <dont ask them for them
| either..sheesh>...
Exile back | is that right??
crickett<!PK!> | <waves at leda>
Leda | :-) Thanks, NS
Erek | Before you usually had people to recommend or warn
| you off someone, if OGL then your tribe
Lady Rapunzel | <-- would protect wry with all her might
crickett<!PK!> | you are going to fast slow down
Exile back | never rush..rushing IMHO is a sure sign of a
| wannabee
wry告lk | OGL, Erek?
Lady Rapunzel | BUT, NS.... if silk chose to do that, and seemed to
| be certain of herself, her soul and her needs, I
| would wish her happiness
crickett<!PK!> | ok
*Night Spirit [HOST] | rushing is a sure sign-----
wry告lk | and Lady Rap has proven that..
*Katie J* | We protect each other, isnt' that a part of
| friendship, D/s or not?
GrandPaDeSade | Sometimes sounding like a preacher is better than
| doing nothing.
Spartan | yes, u can be ur worst enemy by
| rushing......................
Lady Rapunzel | Exc... you can *never* affect the way a listener
| listens... that is their choice
Lord Excalibur | yes Katie this is true
…him | isnt that said of other love?
Erek | wry - Old Guard Leather
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yes Lady R I am sure but you would tell her your
| thoughts right?
wry告lk | thanks :-)
Lady Rapunzel | Yes, if I thought she seemed uncertain, NS... but
| only then
crickett<!PK!> | <sigh ....deep sigh>
…him | anout rushing and love
GrandPaDeSade | How would you feel if you could have stopped a
| meeting, and the person was
GrandPaDeSade | seriously hurt?
Master of Leisure | there is no need to rush,,,,,,,the more
Master of Leisure | discussion the better....
Lady Rapunzel | <-- hands crickett a big bag of Hershey kisses
Erek | Bunch of old fogies my age and older <g> with
| scarely a tooth left amongst 'em <lol>
Lord Excalibur | of course Lady R, that is why I say from the outset
| that I am not all
Lord Excalibur | knoledgeable but can only advise on how I act
crickett<!PK!> | no no no wont work
crickett<!PK!> | thank yo though Lady r
Exile back | so if we see two newbiies one D one s and a collar
| inside a week do we pass
Exile back | comment???
crickett<!PK!> | oops R
Lady Rapunzel | I have no way of knowing, GrPa... and of course I
| would talk about safety to silk, but then I would
| do that with *anyone* here, not
Lady Rapunzel | just people who are meeting in a bdsm relationship
Lord Excalibur | at last we agree Lady R
Lady Rapunzel | Some come here just *for* that, Exile. So who are
| we to frown upon it?
Erek | Exile - the only comment would be "I wish 'em luck"
Master of Leisure | it is their lives..Exile.....they have to learn
| too.....
Leda | That's a good question, Ex--but for a lot of
| people, it's an online fantasy
Leda | only. And do you presume to tell them that they're
| wrong?
*Night Spirit [HOST] | I am not worried about virgins, or newbies, I am
| more concerned with those with
*Night Spirit [HOST] | no knowledge who come in and bring the no knowledge
| to play causing harm
Exile back | and what advice do we give when we know such people
| are metting IRL??
Master of Leisure | it is not for us to pass judgement on them
wry告lk | there are those who offer unsolicted advice.. what
wry告lk | I've discovered lately is that they usually have
| their
wry告lk | own agenda..
GrandPaDeSade | Well, I have had the experiance Lady R. It is NOT a
| good feeling!
Erek | The other side of this is that every one, D or s,
| has to take responsibility for themselves when
| entering a new ...
Lady Rapunzel | I understand that, GrPa, and I am sure I would feel
| terrible, but there is no *practical* solution to
| that problem, I'm afraid.
Erek | relationship.
Lady Rapunzel | You cannot take on that responsibility for others.
Lord Excalibur | I have had several people ask me about R/L meetings
Leda | Absolutely, Erek. :-)
Exile back | everyone has their own agenda wry which is why any
| advice has to be considered
Exile back | from the group as a whole <if you take it at all>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ok so we feel we should take care of ourselves?
GrandPaDeSade | No, but I can for my actions. If I don't try to
| help, it's my failing, not
GrandPaDeSade | theirs
Lord Excalibur | I agree GPDS
Exile back | agreed Erek....but I still find myself concerned...
Master of Leisure | goood point,,,Erek,,,,,and not only here..but also
Master of Leisure | in real life....
Lady Rapunzel | Ultimately, NS, how can it be any other way? Even
| *within* a RL bdsm relationship, without taking
| care of yourself you have nothing.
Exile back | how would we feel if we allowed someone to get hurt
| like that??
Erek | If asked, I'll watch you, backstop you, be your
| safe call, but I can't live your life *for* you!
Lord Excalibur | there are many out there that use this medium to
| pricure one night stands
Master of Leisure | we must be responsible for ourselves before
Master of Leisure | we can be responsible for others.
Exile back | agreed....totally
Leda | NS--the resources are there, advice is there for
| those who want to seek it and
Leda | to listen . . .but in the end, we are responsible
| for ourselves *absolutely*.
Exile back | we must also look after ourselves
Lady Rapunzel | <-- agrees with MoL (and is pointing it out
| because it doesn't happen very often!)
Lady Rapunzel | Girl Power, Leda? <laughs>
Master of Leisure | huggggs..Leda......i missed you coming in
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ok then we feel it is good to ask advice from
| others, but it must be our
*Night Spirit [HOST] | decsion in the long run
Master of Leisure | it does happen,,LadyR
Leda | LOL--grrrrrrlllll power, Rap. ;-)
Leda | Hugs, MoL. :-)
*Katie J* | that's a fair assessment, NS
Lord Excalibur | yes if we look after ourselves, then we can look
| after others
Lady Rapunzel | <hugs Leda in monochrome>
wry告lk | o000o.. love that grrrrrl pwr..
Exile back | yes NS,...absoultely
Master of Leisure | agreed,,,NS
Erek | NS - Yep - has to be our/their decision, or else we
| loose all self-respect and all pretense of
| consensual
Exile back | if we have heard advice but ignored it we are at
| least going in with our eyes
Exile back | open
*Night Spirit [HOST] | OK you met the perfect sub oir dom...everyone else
| doesn't think so, but you
*Night Spirit [HOST] | are sure--what steps should you take to make sure?
Lady Aireanna(busy) | nodding
Lady Rapunzel | Perhaps we could discuss what we deem to be
| *dangerous*, across the board, no matter what your
| prefs are?
Spartan | wasnt that a conference a few weeks ago.....first
| meetings....?
Exile back | depends on circumstances NS..too hypothetical
Master of Leisure | dangerous...try NEAL
Master of Leisure | lol
Exile back | I think it gets discussed most weeks doenst it
| Spartan??
*Katie J* | I have a wanna be in sends ... who started by
| asking ... Am I ready to be tied
*Katie J* | down ...... shall I invite him into the room?
*Katie J* | LMAO
Lady Rapunzel | I can't speak for anyone else, NS, but no-one saw
| my soul until Endie... so no-one else could make
| that judgement but me.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yes spartan--so how to tell a know-it-all from the
| real thing?
namdam | who wants to talk belly button fluff?
Lady Rapunzel | <laughing> Katie
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yes Katie
GrandPaDeSade | Lucy just gave me a hard time. Is it the same
| person Katie?
*Katie J* | I'm trying. <wink>
*Katie J* | no, this is dave
Erek | <<Sheesh>>
*Katie J* | he wants to tie me up.
Lady Rapunzel | <- hugs Dirk
Master of Leisure | hmmm..that was the Easter bunnies
Master of Leisure | sister,,,hon
*Katie J* | oh, yeah, he did say Hey first.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | namdam you are welcome to stay but must stick to
| the topic which is wannabes to
*Night Spirit [HOST] | D/s how to protect ourselves
Dirk | huggs, Rap
*Night Spirit [HOST] | hugs Dirk
namdam | sorrt!
namdam | wot's D/s?
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ok here is a question--can a wannabe ever learn to
| be a good sub or dom?
Master of Leisure | Hey,,,Dirk...good to see you
Exile back | <sigh>
Lady Rapunzel | <laughs>
Lady Rapunzel | What *is* D/s, while we're at it?
*Night Spirit [HOST] | D/s is domaniance and submission
Dirk | greets, shakes, and huggs around
Lady Rapunzel | <laughing>
luscious | hi
Exile back | yes NS...I am sure they can..if they wannabee
Lord Excalibur | if they have the right mental set NS
Leda | Well--we all started as wannabes at one point, NS.
| <G>
Lady Rapunzel | <applause for Exile>
Exile back | <bows to Lady Rap>
Lady Rapunzel | What is the *right* mental set, Exc?
wry告lk | <<is thinking that she is *still* a wannabee..
Erek | NS - a wannabe is by definition incapable, as they
| don't have the internals needed, not to be confused
| with a newbie
Master of Leisure | in time,,,,NS....if the wannabe watches and
Master of Leisure | asks questions
crickett<!PK!> | mutual!
Lady Rapunzel | *What* internals, Erek?
Spartan | evening Dirk...................
Lord Excalibur | if the Dom is capable of living the life mentally
| as well as physically
crickett<!PK!> | i know now i am silie
Marc | Hello
Exile back | Erek....sometimes a newbie may appear to be a
| wannabee
crickett<!PK!> | silkie too
Lord Excalibur | and the same for the sub
Erek | we all started somewhere and where then *new*, but
| we were not necessarily ever wannabes
GrandPaDeSade | I disagree. I diod a lot of research before I first
| picked up a whip. I class
GrandPaDeSade | wannabes as those who dont.
Lady Rapunzel | But what does a Dom *need*, mentally? Is it the
| same for everyone, do you think?
Lady Rapunzel | Can you draw a box around it like that?
Dirk | Mental, I think is the most important part
Dirk | Excalibur
GrandPaDeSade | Agree erek
GrandPaDeSade | With your definition
Lord Excalibur | as far as I am concerned mental attitude is the
| true basis of D/s
crickett<!PK!> | a Dom???? who is the one where that has more to
| lose?/
Lord Excalibur | thank you Dirk
Exile back | GPDS..but some newbies may look like wannabees ....
*Night Spirit [HOST] | hello Marc and welcome
Marc | bonjour
Lord Excalibur | control of the mind Lady R
Lady Rapunzel | Wait, wait... "wannabe"... it's in the name
Exile back | agreed LE
Master of Leisure | it is a major part of it,,LE
*Night Spirit [HOST] | how do we tell a newbie from a wannabe?
Erek | When I first started I was all of 17 and had no
| idea what to even call what I was doing! Made some
| mistakes along the way too. But..
Lord Excalibur | it is the most major part MoL
Lady Rapunzel | <sighing>
GrandPaDeSade | Questioning will reveal if they know anything
| Exile. Attitude counts for a lot
GrandPaDeSade | too.
Exile back | thanks NS for repeating my question a thrid time
Erek | eventually I recognized that this was a core part
| of my sexuality and my ability to express that
Lord Excalibur | greed GPDS
crickett<!PK!> | look who get hurt more????? you or us!!?!??!?!?!?!
Exile back | we cannot tell a wannabee immediatelyt
Exile back | though they themselves probably know that they are
| a wannabee vice a newbie
Lady Rapunzel | Both can lose and gain, crickett
crickett<!PK!> | it is more important to tell want a reall Dom is
Exile back | both can get hurt crickett
GrandPaDeSade | Actually, a dom can suffer a lot of mental damage
| from a sub that doesn't know
GrandPaDeSade | what to do.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | OK is a wannabe dangerous? to themselves and or to
| us?
Lord Excalibur | no a Dom ca be hurt crikett
Lady Rapunzel | Could someone *please* define "wannabe" for me... I
| am confused (it happens a lot to me)
crickett<!PK!> | not as much as i can
Lady Aireanna(busy) | returning and kneeling to the left of my Masters
| side......
Exile back | yes NS...they can hurt badly...from top or bottom
Leda | What distinguishes a wannabe from a newbie? And is
| an "online-only dom"
Leda | considered a wannabe?
Erek | Yes they can be dangerous
Lady Aireanna(busy) | handing him a brandy.
Lady Rapunzel | *Thank* you, Leda
Erek | The first acid test might be "Is this just kinky
| sex for them?"
wry告lk | good one Leda :-)
Lord Excalibur | thank you my dear stroking her hair
…him | good question
Lady Rapunzel | So bdsm can't be just kinky sex?
Lady Aireanna(busy) | wrapping my arm around his leg and listening again.
Erek | If that's *all* it is or ever will be then they
| aren't real.
Lady Aireanna(busy) | looking up smiling..
*Night Spirit [HOST] | a wannabe is one who thinks they know it all and
| has to prove it--a newbie
*Night Spirit [HOST] | wants to learn and will try to
GrandPaDeSade | If I ever hurt someone seriously, I would be very
| hurt mentally. The fact that
GrandPaDeSade | they thought they should take anything I asked them
| to and not complain,
GrandPaDeSade | wouldn't help much.
Lady Rapunzel | We're not allowing kinky sex then?
Lord Excalibur | good discription NS
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Erek good point
Exile back | i guess a "wannabee" is form of sarcasm
Leda | For some people, Erek, that's all they are looking
| for--an online fantasy. I
Leda | mean "doms" and "subs."
Exile back | they actually do not wannabee
Lady Rapunzel | What about those who *want* to do it and just make
| the mistake of rushing into it?
Exile back | wheres as a newbie does wannabee
Lady Rapunzel | We are talking about judgement here, about
| rationale, not about "wannabees" and "newbies"
Exile back | <deciding to get another drink, as he just confused
| himself>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | right Exile they are know it alls, what you do is
| wrong, they are right and
*Night Spirit [HOST] | they will prove it anyway they can including
| hurting others
Dirk | This is probably a minority opinion... but I think
| it
Dirk | is difficult for one to "become" dom. One can
Dirk | "become" a good "top". And, it's also possible
Dirk | for someone to have "buried" this, esp.
Dirk | because of the misunderstanding that the
Dirk | concept of D/s engenders in the public's mind.
GrandPaDeSade | The difference is that the damage to the sub can be
| physical, mental and
GrandPaDeSade | finiancial. For the dom, only the last two.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | a newbie wants to learn, takes the steps to
| learn--basically like we all did
Lord Excalibur | I agree with GPDS I am very careful to explain and
| comfort and know that I am
Erek | GranPa - very early on I had a sub wanted a lot
| more violent actions than I was really into, I went
| along as *she* had the ...
Lord Excalibur | not going to seriously hurt, just because the sub
| wants to please
Erek | experience and got myself into a very bad head space
Spartan | i am not sure, but in review here this evening if i
| can blinder what we r
Spartan | really talking about here is not the wannabee.....i
| think we have covered that
Spartan | ground early in the CO, but i think the much harder
| questions we need to look
Spartan | at within the topic is the *dangerous*
| wannabe...wannabees are ok, isnt that
Spartan | also what this median is for as well as the
| possible r/l encounters to come
Spartan | from it, but the danger of a wannabe in
| R/L.....that is the scarry one.....
Lady Rapunzel | But we are discussing how to tell a *dangerous*
| person in this medium, aren't we?
Lady Aireanna(busy) | absolutly
GrandPaDeSade | Agree Dirk
*Katie J* | <watching the Spartan's server take a deep breath>
Lord Excalibur | yes a wannabee Dom in R/L could be very dangerous
| to my mind
Exile back | I think thats important Spartan...hence I think
| that we as a group should
Exile back | exercise the right to offer precautiobnary advice
| if we are aware of an IRL
Exile back | meeting...
*Night Spirit [HOST] | well my concern are those who will not listen and
| basically will whip you any
*Night Spirit [HOST] | damn way they like---
Lady Aireanna(busy) | lol
Spartan | <s>...katie..hey it is only the 4th comment
| tonight.....lol
GrandPaDeSade | That's what I mean Erek.
Lady Aireanna(busy) | and very acute......
Leda | Dangerous covers a lot of ground though.
| Inexperience is as dangerous as
Leda | malice, IMO. But is an inexperienced Dom a
| "wannabe?"
Lady Rapunzel | But surely, anyone who meets someone IRL should be
| advised to take precautions, no matter *what* the
| situation? bdsm or no bdsm...
Lady Rapunzel | surely it's the same?
Erek | I'll testify that you're right about it GrPa <s>
Dirk | not in my mind, Leda
Lady Rapunzel | And can't inexperienced people meet and learn about
| bdsm IRL too?
Exile | yes LR..it is
Spartan | yes
| LadyR...............................................
| ..............
Exile | but there si more potential for inadvertent
| physical danger in a bdsm meet
Lady Rapunzel | We are saying "Be careful if you meet IRL". Have we
| said that before?
GrandPaDeSade | I know Doms who have left the scene because of a
| bad experience with a sub.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Leda if the inexperience Dom says I am new to this,
| I am learning, teach me
*Night Spirit [HOST] | what you know--then he is a newbie--if he says I
| will do what I want, shut up
*Night Spirit [HOST] | and take it--he is dangerous
Master of Leisure | I dont agree there,,Leda.....
Lord Excalibur | yes Lady R but preferably not one to one, but with
| at least one other person a
Lord Excalibur | friend or coleague
Dirk | great measure, NS
!PhantomKnight | <glides back in>
GrandPaDeSade | I also know of subs who have woulnd up in the
| hospital because of a bad dom.
Leda | I didn't make a statement to agree or disagree
| with, MoL. <g> I asked a
Leda | question.
Lord Excalibur | or in a club
Lady Rapunzel | So we are saying: If you meet for a RL bdsm
| experience, be *more* careful.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | we have alot of new folks come on daily--how do we
| know which are serious and
*Night Spirit [HOST] | which are not?
Lady Rapunzel | Do we need to say that?
Exile | in time NS...in time...only in time
Erek | I think most of us have horror stories we could
| tell.
Lady Aireanna(busy) | one needs to be careful in all life....
Lord Excalibur | very true my darling
Exile | one nighters clearly go pretty quickly
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lady A is correct on line is a major part of our
| lives this is part of what we
*Night Spirit [HOST] | are---we are as much a community here as in RL
!PhantomKnight | <looks around and sees lot's of familiar faces>
Exile | but some get sucked into a wannabee fixation
Master of Leisure | one needs to use common sense and gain as
Master of Leisure | much knowledge of the sub or Dom that they
Master of Leisure | are discovering too
Lady Aireanna(busy) | thank you NS
Leda | All the usual answers to that, NS--time . .
| .communication--lots of
Leda | communication---talking to other people about that
| person . . .
GrandPaDeSade | Yes, but the inherrent trust many submissives
| display in the D/s scene vcan be
GrandPaDeSade | dangerous for them.
Erek | <Kisa> Perhaps the worst horror story is having an
| entire forum deny that one of it's members was raped
Exile | but we canot deny them that trsut GPDS...
Lady Aireanna(busy) | so perfectly true GPDS
Dirk | this is *the* Kisa????? huggs, m'dear
Leda | Trust is a big part of WIITWD, GrandPa--but anyone
| that gives that trust
Leda | lightly and before it is merited is taking too big
| a risk.
GrandPaDeSade | True, but the trust should be tempered with common
| sense.
Exile | if we take away their trust we take away opart of
| the raison d'etre
Lady Rapunzel | Maybe we should look at the way we are in the room?
Lady Rapunzel | That's what most people see, after all.
Exile | ah...good old "common sense"
Lady Aireanna(busy) | there you have it..
Lady Rapunzel | It's the place we have the widest audience.
Erek | We still are locked out over the upshot on that one
| - and I, Erek, do not intend to ever return there
Erek | Hiya Dirk!
Exile | how many think they have that and yet do not???
Erek | Did not realize that was our Dirk <g>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | hiya Kisa hugs sweety--I know it was like I met one
| here who stole money from
*Night Spirit [HOST] | me and others, and physically torchered me....I
| knew him over a yr. on line--he
*Night Spirit [HOST] | was a wannabe--he never learned how
Dirk | still? sheeeesh.
Exile | <huggs> NS
Lady Rapunzel | Are we saying... We should be communicative, very
| careful about meeting IRL, and try to watch out for
| others who don't know much
Lady Rapunzel | about this scene?
Lord Excalibur | Unfortunately NS there will always be one
Dirk | it's "our" Dirk, Kisa
GrandPaDeSade | She had the skin torn off of her nipples. (NS did)
Lady Rapunzel | Is that what we are saying?
Exile | I think so LR
Lord Excalibur | yes LR
Lady Rapunzel | Does everyone agree with that?
Exile | we are a community and sghould act like one
Lady Rapunzel | Yes.. support each other as much as possible.
| Right, everyone?
*Night Spirit [HOST] | no Lord E that is the problem there are more then
| one--personally I would like
wry告lk | as a newbie.. I would hope that you would offer
wry告lk | guidnce and support.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | us to help each other to never get hurt again--
GrandPaDeSade | It's the only way to protect ourselves.
Lady Rapunzel | Then let's look at the way we behave (and encourage
| behaviour) in the room.
Lady Rapunzel | Anyone got anything to say about that?
Lord Excalibur | agree totally NS
Dirk | Rap, I think that there are some cautions that
Dirk | should be observed, and there are places one
Dirk | can get some guidelines for doing that. But, a
Dirk | lot fo this is common sense....
Lady Rapunzel | It is, after all, the widest audience we have.
Erek | Shun the "Cave Man Doms" ???? <g>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | never let a Dom or sub tell you NOT to communicate
| with others, if something
*Night Spirit [HOST] | feels wrong--maybe it is, trust is earned and not
| given
Lady Aireanna(busy) | <s>
Lady Rapunzel | Shun the tradition of every sub calling every Dom
| "Sir", perhaps?
Lord Excalibur | agreed Ns
Erek | Ignore function DoMeNow subs???
Exile | I do have something in mind lady Rap??
Spartan | ~%domdoobe domwooo o, dobedobedom dobedomwooo o,..
| ....yes tonight i fell in
Spartan | love...~%. sorry just wanted to share that ..it
| seemed befitting.....
Spartan | .
GrandPaDeSade | Sir should be earned also.
Lady Rapunzel | Dismiss the idea that any man with the word
| "Master" in his name should be treated as if he is
| an expert?
Lady Aireanna(busy) | LOL>>>>
Dirk | I agree, GPDS
Exile | <smile>
Lady Rapunzel | Maybe?
wry告lk | <laffing>
Leda | <S>@Rap
*Katie J* | I can count on one hand the number of Doms I call
| Sir.
Dirk | yep, Rap
Lady Rapunzel | <-- is not referring to anyone in particular
Leda | I can count on one finger, Katie. <g>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lady R I like playing on line time to time...but I
| let them know it is play
*Katie J* | that is a true measure of respect for me.
wry告lk | I think that Sir's are earned.. by the smart ones
wry告lk | anyway..
Master of Leisure | good point,,,NS......i know of some subs who
Master of Leisure | have told me that their Dom didnt want them
Master of Leisure | talking to others.........that tells me a lot about
Master of Leisure | that so-called Dom
Exile | Sir should be earned...but for many calling an
| older man sir is good manners
Dirk | exactly, Katie
!PhantomKnight | <agrees with wry> but do we have to be "experts"to
| be called sir?
Erek | I have no objection to Sir - I do to the demand for
| Master - very few people have earned that
Lady Rapunzel | But can easily be mis-read by others, Exile
GrandPaDeSade | I do not expect anyone I do not have a master/slave
| (etc.) relationship with to
GrandPaDeSade | call me Sir, or anything else special.
Lady Aireanna(busy) | I call all Doms sir.............until I am proved
| that they are not worthy
*Night Spirit [HOST] | if someone wants you to keep them a secret and take
| you from others either
*Night Spirit [HOST] | online or RL--ask yourself why would they do that?
Lord Excalibur | I agree with that MoL they don't want the sub to
| learn as far as I am concerned
Lady Rapunzel | Don't we have a responsibility to show a cautious
| public face of bdsm in the room?
Exile | I agree Lady Rap...so we do need to excercise
| caution in that respect
Lady Aireanna(busy) | it happens very quickly many times.
Master of Leisure | looks at his handle..hmmmmm.....does not
Master of Leisure | profess to be an expert,,,,does profess to have
Master of Leisure | knowledge
Erek | Yes - common courtesy to address them plitely, at
| least until they prove they don't deserve courtesy.
wry告lk | and kindness and sensitivity, MoL.. that makes you a
wry告lk | Sir.
Lady Rapunzel | <-- risking it.... Who told you that you have
| knowledge, MoL?
!PhantomKnight | never professes to be an expert...always learning
GrandPaDeSade | Lady A, I would say they should earn it fiorst.
Exile | if someone I had not met before called me sir i
| would immediately question
Exile | their actions...but that is just me
Master of Leisure | the idea is to have your sub learn as much as
Master of Leisure | possible , not only about you,,but about
Master of Leisure | herself and her relationships with others
Lady Aireanna(busy) | I do it out of respect.......
Lady Aireanna(busy) | for the honor ....
Lady Rapunzel | You profess to have knowledge, yet maybe, for some,
| your knowledge is not appropriate, MoL
Master of Leisure | thank you,,,wry,,,i do appreciate that
*Night Spirit [HOST] | MoL our names fit what we want them too......and
| besides even some of us have
*Night Spirit [HOST] | kinks others might find dangerous--hwo can you tell
| if one has the knowledge or
*Night Spirit [HOST] | spouting off and pretending
Lady Aireanna(busy) | if they are not worhty
Spartan | <wonders what TME might say....laughing
| inside>........
Lady Aireanna(busy) | they will not get another reply.
Erek | BRB
Lady Rapunzel | Surely it is a *danger* to profess to have
| knowledge, within this community and within a
| public arena?
*Katie J* | Next, probably, Spartan.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | PK is right---in all reality we are all learning
Master of Leisure | No one tells me,,,,Lady.R....i know myself
Master of Leisure | well,,hon....thru my life and experiences....
!PhantomKnight | thanks NS>....
GrandPaDeSade | Thats a good approach lady A
*Night Spirit [HOST] | well Lady R there are very few people I trust to
| set me on fire
Lady Aireanna(busy) | lowering my head and eyes.......
Lady Rapunzel | And your knowledge is appropriate for everyone who
| sees you profess to be wise, is it MoL?
Exile | none of us can claim to have the final best word on
| this subject
Lady Aireanna(busy) | thank you Sitr.
Lady Aireanna(busy) | opps
Exile | few people even come close
Lady Aireanna(busy) | Sir.....
Lady Aireanna(busy) | <s>
Lord Excalibur | proud smile at my darling Lady Aireanna
Exile | yes we are all learning..all the time
Exile | its called life
Master of Leisure | that may be so..LadyR......I am not perfect..but I
Master of Leisure | know myself....and what i like and what i can
Master of Leisure | do.....in my lfe....
wry告lk | when we stop wanting to learn.. something dies.
Lady Rapunzel | I am just saying.... what we do in the roomis
| observed by those who wish to learn, and by those
| who wish to play, and by those who
Lady Rapunzel | are potentially dangerous.
!PhantomKnight | <agrees with Exile> and to have someone to learn
| with is great
*Katie J* | Lady R, only if it rings true to the listener .. we
| dont' see life from the
*Katie J* | same angle, any of us.
Lord Excalibur | I agree with Exile we are always learning finding
| new ways,
Exile | agreed wry
<cuffed> (f) N' Nude | so,,,, Now i know why dom/sub chat is so empty
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yes Exile, in all reality we are learning and I
| find our gathers here and on 10
*Night Spirit [HOST] | a good place for feedback and to learn what we are
| all about
<cuffed> (f) N' Nude | closes door
Lady Rapunzel | How can you be certain that the listener is capable
| of rational judgement?
Lady Aireanna(busy) | listen...
Exile | NS..yes I find this a most useful way to find out
| how others think
Exile | to broaden my own limited horizons
Lord Excalibur | it is possible Lady R
wry告lk | I don't think that you can Lady R.. and that's the
wry告lk | chance that the *wise* person is taking.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lady R, as in all things how can be sure of
| anything?
Lady Rapunzel | So do we have, perhaps, a responsibility to add a
| disclaimer with all advice given?
!PhantomKnight | I for one know that I have only tpuched the tip of
| the iceberg on D/s
Lord Excalibur | I do Lady R
Dirk | I think that's it unfortunate that there are so
Dirk | few "informative" conversations in 10
Erek | bak
Exile | yes Lady Rap...all advice is really just IYHO
Leda | <G> There is a standard one, Rap--"your mileage may
| vary."
*Katie J* | too many wannabes, Dirk.
Lady Rapunzel | Then we should agree that that needs to be *said*,
| Exile
*Night Spirit [HOST] | in a way Lady R--by saying in "my opinion" which
| may not be others but "I feel
*Night Spirit [HOST] | this way"
wry告lk | that goes back to the newbies/wannabees/kisskiss
wry告lk | stuff, Dirk.
Dirk | there is an oppty there to do some good
Dirk | education...... but it gets lost and diluted.
Exile | perhaps so lady Rap...and I know that I am as much
| at fault for not saying that
Exile | as anyone else
Exile | even though I may be thinking it'
GrandPaDeSade | We are trying to add more Dirk
Lady Rapunzel | I was just trying to make a point... and I know
| that most of you *do* add a disclaimer
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Dirk that is why Katie opened up TALK to us, and I
| got CSi to give me this
*Night Spirit [HOST] | place back when TALK passed on
Master of Leisure | nods at Dirk........
wry告lk | I don't think that it will ever happen in the
| channel
wry告lk | though..
Erek | Dirk - it's been our experience that most of the
| old time serious CH10 people have gone irc
!PhantomKnight | irc?
Lady Rapunzel | <-- is trying, as the title of this conference
| says, to find ways of making this medium offer
| *safety*
Dirk | yes, Kisa...... it's just that I have not been able
Dirk | to track them down.... and that is such a fluid
Dirk | place
*Night Spirit [HOST] | irc=internet relay chat and most of them rarely go
| there now
wry告lk | but the IRC channels are much of the same.. strictly
wry告lk | social gathering places.
Master of Leisure | a lot of them,,,have,,,,Erek
Exile | The confeerences are a far better way to get and to
| solicit advice than the room
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Dirk e-mail Pebs
Dirk | ok, NS....... I will
Master of Leisure | there are some specifc rooms that they go to
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ok--any last words?
wry告lk | and here it's sane and rather sensible.
Exile | yes wry...and everyone has an equal say in the
| conferences
Erek | Repeat some good advice??? ___ Use Common Sense ___
*Night Spirit [HOST] | MoL they used to go undernet-#QVB and now rarely
| do, Pebs arranges times for
*Night Spirit [HOST] | meetings
Exile | its much more of a level playing field
Dirk | I haven't seen Pebs in years.... she and Dang
Dirk | still around?
Lady Rapunzel | Yes. Help, but make it clear that you are only
| giving your opinion. Talk, but talk objectively.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yes Dirk they are doing great
Leda | She was in Ch. 10 the other night, Dirk
GrandPaDeSade | How about consentual, safe, and caring? (Sanity
| varies.)
Master of Leisure | they also go to domination lounge...NS
Dirk | kewl
Spartan | ya know, '10' has always had an air in it, and i
| think it is what we also go
Spartan | their for, to have fun, and see friends,,,,but the
| heavier discussions have
Spartan | always been more in sends etc and sometimes this
| becomes unfortunate to the
Spartan | ones learning, but we need to control the
| environment more as we used to to
Spartan | allow more of a haven for those sometimes who do
| have questions, and foster a
Spartan | place to ask them openly, but unles we police the
| craptrap which we have been
Spartan | apathetic to do as of late , then the serios ones
| feel hindered and dont ask,
Spartan | that is the one diff i see in this new environment
| from how it was , lets say 2
Spartan | - 3 years ago..........
*Katie J* | nicely phrased, GrandPa <s>
Master of Leisure | Pebs had been here ..Dirk
Lady Aireanna(busy) | time out.....scrolling up
wry告lk | Lady R.. if that's what you did when I solicited
| your
wry告lk | advice.. then it's the clue.. you helped me
wry告lk | enormously..
Lady Rapunzel | <smile> silk... no, darling... you helped yourself.
Exile | maybe we should invite more newbies to the
| conferences
Dirk | <uploading an editor to Spartan>
Lady Rapunzel | <uploading a beer to Spartan>
!PhantomKnight | well said Spartan
Dirk | lol
*Night Spirit [HOST] | well I can tell you chat is in for changes---the
| helpers will be back covering
*Night Spirit [HOST] | it again and we are looking for helpers
Exile | how does the conference invite list get established
| each week??
Erek | Hit enter more often Spartan <g>
*Katie J* | <applauds Spartan's expression of Domness by taking
| over 2 entire Screens >
Lord Excalibur | thank s for a 21" screen
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Exile I am lucky--Miss Katie handles it
*Katie J* | now that is Domination!
Exile | Katie??
Lady Rapunzel | <-- adores the way Spartan speaks
Lady Aireanna(busy) | rofl.....
wry告lk | I would hope that they group would stay much as it
wry告lk | is.. there are those that some of us see as
wry告lk | wannabees.. that others don't see that way..
Lady Aireanna(busy) | me too....
GrandPaDeSade | Besides, I've always said i'd hate to meet anyone
| who was completely sane.
GrandPaDeSade | They'd be boring.
wry告lk | we accomplish stuff here now.. would we if the list
wry告lk | was expanded..?
Master of Leisure | still scrolling.....
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yep Katie J sends out the invites---I am the humble
| host--and I do take
*Night Spirit [HOST] | suggestions
~ロR | er bite me or something
~ロR | lol
Lady Aireanna(busy) | still lol.....
*Katie J* | I will add anyone who emails me and askes.
Lord Excalibur | me as well KatieJ
Lady Rapunzel | May I make a suggestion?
wry告lk | ^^perfect example..
Exile | katie...a newbie may not know that you arrange these
*Night Spirit [HOST] | now any ideas on next weeks CO?
Dirk | sure, Rap
Leda | Well--we do try to talk it up in the room. <s>
GrandPaDeSade | Always Lady R
Erek | GrPa --- I'm Sane!!! Just a little paranoid around
| the edges is all. Besides being paranoid doesn't
| mean they're *not out to
Lady Rapunzel | Could we, perhaps, try having one of these *in*
| room 10 one day?
Erek | get you
*Violent Angel* | <---New e-mail address Katie, Sweets <s>
Exile | in the past i usually fwd them to people I think
| would benefit
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Erek and Kisa maybe sorta sane <wink>
GrandPaDeSade | NS, what do you think?
*Katie J* | thanks, VA sis! hugggggs
Dirk | I think that would be a great idea, Rap
*Violent Angel* | No, don't use this one! LOL
Lady Rapunzel | I don't see why we shouldn't give it a go.
GrandPaDeSade | Btw, I went and anounced this in 10 just before we
| started.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yes Lady R it is possible however there are
| different rules in chat then here
*Violent Angel* | my3959@aol.com
Master of Leisure | I like that idea..LadyR.......seee..we can agree
Lady Rapunzel | <laughs> MoL
Spartan | <buckles his belt, knowing all well and good his
| friends know he just dropped
Spartan | his pants and mooned them all
| >..........................
*Night Spirit [HOST] | in here I am allowed to control the subject and we
| stick to it
Lady Rapunzel | <laughing, a lot, aloud, Spartan>
Erek | There is that
Master of Leisure | chuckling.....
*Night Spirit [HOST] | on chat I am not allowed to, so it can go anywhere
Dirk | why can't that happen in 10, though, NS?
Erek | No one has any control in 10
wry告lk | I have to say something.. if this gets turned into a
wry告lk | *party* many of the benefits are going to be lost.
Lady Rapunzel | Yes, but surely we would all just stick to the
| topic and ignore others, NS?
GrandPaDeSade | In 10 anyone can say almost anything.
!PhantomKnight | maybe if the trouble makers in CH10 came in and saw
| a
!PhantomKnight | "Serious" D/s discussion they would stop being
| trouble makers or
!PhantomKnight | just leave
Lady Rapunzel | Could we try it, at least?
Casey J. | <~~ waiting for permission to say "Hi".
*Katie J* | too many wannabes flitting through
~ロR & BD | <reading carefully>
*Katie J* | hugggggs, Casey :)
namdam | hi!
Dirk | I'd like to give it a try
Lady Rapunzel | Wannabes are people too ;)
Casey J. | Hi all!! :-)
~ロR & BD | Caseyyyy Jumper woo woo
*Night Spirit [HOST] | chat is a forum for users, we can group, but on 10
| chat rules apply, in forums
*Night Spirit [HOST] | the host of the CO has rein
*Night Spirit [HOST] | hiya Casey
Erek | I've never seen trouble makers leave when they have
| targets of opportunity
!PhantomKnight | true Erek....true
Master of Leisure | too many NEALS and Iceman...PK
Lady Rapunzel | All it takes is for us to ignore them... we just
| have to avoid getting riled.
Exile | thats what mass squelches are for Erek
*Violent Angel* | Erm, excuse me for saying but it does seem a little
| "them and us" in here.
!PhantomKnight | lol MoL
~ロR & BD | casey is it 143?
*Violent Angel* | Sorry, had to mention
Casey J. | CSR, yes.
~ロR & BD | i forgetted
~ロR & BD | ok i remembered
~ロR & BD | lol
Lady Rapunzel | Anyway, a lot of them might stay and want to join in
Erek | VA - it *is* us -or- them <g>
Master of Leisure | its worth a try,,,,NS...
wry告lk | but the point is.. EVERYONE doesn't squelch.. you
wry告lk | always have one or two responding..
*Katie J* | We don't generally greet while a conference is
| going on, VA .....
Lady Rapunzel | Vote on it?
GrandPaDeSade | No one from there came here when I announced it
| there.
*Katie J* | interrupts the flow of the convo
~ロR & BD | hey there katie J
namdam | i did say hello...
*Night Spirit [HOST] | VA not really in forums the host has to keep the
| subject on hand, controls the
~ロR & BD | hiya VA<s>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | air of it. In chat a HELPER has no power
…him | ?
jane bi | hi jane here 26 bi call me on private chat if you
| are a genuine female who
jane bi | whants to release some tension.Please no lyinng
| male i will know
!PhantomKnight | CH 10 needs to be revitalized
*Violent Angel* | No I don't suppose you do Katie but I am reading
| the text with great interest....
*Violent Angel* | and I see much "them"
Exile | ho hum jane
~ロR & BD | lol jane....i am tarzan<s>
Master of Leisure | hmm...good point,,NS.......that could be a
Master of Leisure | problem
namdam | bye
Erek | "BONG!"
Spartan | here we go again...i think and have been discussing
| with others the seriousness
Spartan | of going back to casual chat where 10 was and is
| still........yes, we always
Spartan | had travelers thru there, but less as i believe
| more are drawn to intimate chat
Spartan | thinking it is more intimate causing many more
| oportunities for
Spartan | disturbances...casual is much less frequented by
| the general public here...
*Violent Angel* | No group is exclusive in it's interests nomatter
| how regualr they may be.
Lady Rapunzel | I just think that a lot of people are missing out
*Night Spirit [HOST] | I am the IChat d/s HOST--I am allowed to control
| this--as a HELPER I can only
*Night Spirit [HOST] | enforce the no attack, no racist
| stuff--otherwise--have to let whatever happens
Lady Rapunzel | ... and that's a shame... and it's what we have
| been discussing tonight
~ロR & BD | the topic is????
…him | LR missing out on what
*Katie J* | Different limits, eh, NS?
Lady Rapunzel | Missing out on the chance to talk, explore, learn,
| discuss....
Exile | well I think you do a jolly good job NS <claps>
Dirk | NS..... but, how is this different here from
Dirk | what could be done on 10?
…him | ok
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Spartan on casual there is a D/s room for casual
| chit chat, and one on inimate
*Night Spirit [HOST] | more for play--which I fought to get both
Master of Leisure | she has no control over the problem
Master of Leisure | individuals..Dirk
Lady Rapunzel | I am missing out on anything I might learn from
| those who don't know about this, for a start
Lord Excalibur | I applied for a librarians job a while back but as
| yet have heard nothing, a
Lord Excalibur | librarian can shut the troublemakers out
Dirk | can you kick them here, NS?
Spartan | NS, up until last year, casual is where we all used
| to meet, not in
Spartan | intimate........
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Dirk on 10 basically all I can do is toss racists
| and those who insult others.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Here I can toss those who disrupt and won't stick
| to the subject
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yes spartan I know
Erek | The point being that if you can kick someone, there
| tends to be less disruption
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lord E do it again the entire staff has changed
Lady Rapunzel | Don't you think that it's worth a try?
Master of Leisure | exactly,,Erek,,,and the discussion flows
*Violent Angel* | <Ponders whether I warrant a "wannabe" badge or a
| "someone with interest" badge, or indeed a "someone
*Violent Angel* | that is irrelevant in the field" badge. Where have
| you decided to make the line on a "wannabee" <--Not
| meant
*Violent Angel* | disrespectfully
Lord Excalibur | who is the head now NS?
GrandPaDeSade | Lady R, they didn't care to come here when i
| announced it.
~ロR & BD | and less means to express...and b booted due to
~ロR & BD | ones ability to judge...
Lady Rapunzel | It would seem less... I don't know... clique-ey
Erek | NS - I was thinking of here versus there
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lord E it is Skeem in Ichat and casual adult and
| Martie on general
Casey J. | who is Lord E and what is 10?
Lord Excalibur | thanks hons
Dirk | GPDS but there is a critical mass of
Dirk | "interested" people who are here..... and it we
Dirk | announced, and just started it... I think it could
Dirk | go.
Lady Rapunzel | But GrPa... maybe they would benefit if they were
| able to be present, and not by choice.... aren't we
| discussing those who *think*
Lady Rapunzel | they know everything? Why would they make the
| effort to come here? But if *we* were *there*....
Spartan | we r still all forgetting, we can squelch, keep the
| screen nice and
Spartan | clean.......then you can end up limiting the tripe
| u see and could possibly
Spartan | maintain a good conversation going....
Exile | Lady Rap...are you suggesting 10 has permanent
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lady R we can try there
Dirk | yes, Spartan
Exile | coinference stauts..or just at 8pm EST on Sundays
Lady Rapunzel | I just think it might be worth a try
Erek | Dirk - I count 19 people here - that's a pretty
| good number for * any * CO
Master of Leisure | Its worth a try,,,NS
wry告lk | disband this one?
Dirk | I agree, Kisa
wry告lk | please.. no!
Lady Rapunzel | Not necessarily, silk
Erek | Erek here actually <g>
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Exile as of now that is the only one I do, if and
| when GrPa gets his badge
*Night Spirit [HOST] | back--he will also host one
Lady Rapunzel | Just try one there instead, for once
GrandPaDeSade | Well, we could try it I suppose, But I suspect it
| will end in disastor. You
GrandPaDeSade | can't squelch those who haven't squelched them and
| respond to them.
Erek | Kisa is fixing our dinner
Exile | Personally I think we should give it a try for
| those who want to
wry告lk | agreed GrPa
Lady Rapunzel | Open mind, GrPa ;)
Exile | I suspect we will be back here fairly quickly
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Erek what is Kisa making?
Lady Rapunzel | Hey! Give it a chance, guys!
Master of Leisure | see how it goes..NS....if its a problem we can
Master of Leisure | always not do it again...
Casey J. | bye all!
Lady Rapunzel | All this negative thinking <tsk tsk>
Dirk | I think some rulz would help, and if those who
Dirk | "know" about the CO follow them, those
Dirk | drifting in would soon get the idea, perhaps
Exile | <s> @ LR
Lord Excalibur | the more places for discussion the more people will
| learn
Dirk | reinforced with a timely macro from the Host
Erek | NS - Some sort of pasta, I'll discover what in a
| few minutes <g>
Lady Rapunzel | <- agrees with Dirk (Hell, most of what I know I
| know from Dirk anyway.. <laughs>)
GrandPaDeSade | I would suggest continuing this on Sundays.
| Scheduling one there, and see what
GrandPaDeSade | happens.
Dirk | <smiles at Rap>
Lady Rapunzel | Sounds good, GrPa
*Night Spirit [HOST] | ok subjects for next week's?
!PhantomKnight | just go for it.......CH10..here...hell, everywhere
Exile | Agree GPDS
wry告lk | <phew> thanks guys.
Master of Leisure | agrees with GPDS.....if we dont try one
Master of Leisure | there,,,we will never know how it will work
Lord Excalibur | agree with you GPDS
Exile | <s> @ wry
*Night Spirit [HOST] | otherwise I shall pick it
Lady Rapunzel | So... when are we having a CO in Room 10?
Scotty | Evening all
GrandPaDeSade | Lets set up next week here first.
wry告lk | you've been doing an excellent job NS.. you can
wry告lk | pick as far as I'm concerned.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | hiya Scotty?
Exile | <argh...I won't be here next week>
wry告lk | let's do the wannabee topic on 10..
Lady Rapunzel | I want *you* there, NS <smile> As helper or not, I
| don't care
wry告lk | that should be interesting.
Leda | We'll log it for you, Exile. <s>
Scotty | Hi spirit
Exile | thanks Leda
Exile | <s>
GrandPaDeSade | We will discuss this, and announce what we will be
| doing re. CH 10 next week.
Leda | That's a great idea, wry. <s>
!PhantomKnight | ewwww wry....that'll be a hot topic.....lol
Erek | Hmmm subjects --- "Contracts, good or bad?" "Safe
| words, use 'em or lose 'em?"
Lady Rapunzel | Who is "we", GrPa?
*Night Spirit [HOST] | OK next weeks topic is "What the hell is a collar
| for?"
wry告lk | let's see wha tthe wannabee's have to say about
wry告lk | themselves.
GrandPaDeSade | NS, Katie J. and I
*Katie J* | <waving>
Lady Rapunzel | Ahhh... the Management ;)
Exile | do we have to invite them in especially wry??
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Erek hon--email those to me--will ya :)
Erek | NS --- You might add "Just what constitutes a
| collar?"
Dirk | next week here, NS? or there?
wry告lk | they'll be there to show that they aren't wannabee's
wry告lk | Exile :-)
Exile | well I hope someone mails it to me <s> @ Leda
*Night Spirit [HOST] | here Dirk.....if you want to schedule one on chat
| go for it
Master of Leisure | NS...and the meaning of the collar
Dirk | ok
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yep MoL that is next week's topic
Lady Rapunzel | What, *without* consulting The Management, NS?
| <teasing smile at GrPa>
Leda | Gotcha covered, Ex. ;-)
Lord Excalibur | should be a good topic NS
GrandPaDeSade | I suspect the discussion will envelop all aspects
| of collars.
*Katie J* | NS< if you want me to do the mailing, they can send
| to me, at KatieJ <my
*Katie J* | address> and I'll ad d them to the list.
Master of Leisure | winks at LadyR...i will chat with the
Master of Leisure | management.....
Erek | Uh - I have a caution about using CB as a meeting
| place
Lady Rapunzel | <laughs> MoL's got it covered, everyone! You can
| all relax!
Dirk | what is that, Kisa?
Exile | <--already relaxed
Master of Leisure | chuckling.....lurrrrves ya...LadyR
Dirk | (or Erek)
Lady Rapunzel | Ya huh, MoL ;)
*Night Spirit [HOST] | yep Lady R I am going out on a limb
GrandPaDeSade | Lady R, we have set up the subject already.
Erek | Remember that you can not swear there or use words
| like clit or even say orgasim
Dirk | on 10?
Lady Rapunzel | <-- was just kidding around!
Dirk | <blink>
Erek | Kinda makes an open discussion a little strained
!PhantomKnight | not on Adult CH10...anything goes there
Leda | <G>Hell--doesn't stop anyone now, Erek.
Erek | Yep - CSi says so
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Erek yes you can on inimtate chat
wry告lk | isn't NS *our* CSi? <g>
GrandPaDeSade | Besides, if she does something wrong, then I get to
| have soem fun. On second
Master of Leisure | chucklin..I am hopin they do..GPDS
*Katie J* | Erek, I have the guidelines, and it is ok some
| places.
!PhantomKnight | intimate CH 10 is ok...has not stopped anyone yet
GrandPaDeSade | We know you were Lady R.
!PhantomKnight | ok all....I'm off to find my sub..nit
Lady Rapunzel | Ahhh
~ロR & BD | <lookin at piccys wow>
~ロR & BD | i am scared
~ロR & BD | see ya
~ロR & BD | LMAO
Master of Leisure | nite,,PK
Exile | Time to carry on moving boxes.....see you all
| later....byeeeee
Erek | just quoted me - gives the PTA types leeway.
GrandPaDeSade | NS, my fingers need something to hold on to a
| squeeze.
GrandPaDeSade | Something attached to you.
Exile | night lady rap
Leda | Hell--we complain now about how people act
| sometimes, wry--and no one does
Leda | anything. <G>
Exile | bye MoL
Leda | Hugs, Exile. :-)
Lord Excalibur | well my friends it is 2:40 here and I have to work
| in the morning, thank you
Lord Excalibur | for a good CO again NS GPDS and Katie J please keep
| me informed of any new CO's
Lord Excalibur | on differant forums
kara (C) | thank you for such an interesting forum <s>
wry告lk | <nod>
Exile | <huggs> Leda
Master of Leisure | you can say that again,,Leda
*Katie J* | yes, Lord E <s>
GrandPaDeSade | Night Lord E.
*Night Spirit [HOST] | Lord E thank you very much for comming :)
wry告lk | huggggs Exile :-)
*Night Spirit [HOST] | thank you kara
Master of Leisure | take care...LE...good to see you
Lord Excalibur | thank you for holding the CO
*Night Spirit [HOST] | this offically concludes this CO
Exile | <huggs> wry <s>
********** 4/12/98 6:43 PM End logging Sub Pub - D/s.